This Earth Day, we’re diving into how the work-from-home movement is reshaping our environmental impact. Bospar Principal, Curtis Sparrer. joins Eric Chemi to examine how companies can implement sustainable practices that benefit both the environment and their bottom line.
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00:00:09.840 Today is Earth Day
00:00:12.240 so we’re talking about sustainability in
00:00:14.559 business and no better guest to have
00:00:16.720 than Curtis Sparr the principal founder
00:00:19.439 of Bospar who’s here with us today
00:00:21.680 you’re at the the forefront of
00:00:23.439 innovation when it comes to remote work
00:00:25.039 you were doing it years and years and
00:00:27.039 years before COVID made everyone have to
00:00:29.359 do it and I remember when you first told
00:00:30.480 me the story you said “Hey I’m starting
00:00:32.079 up my own shop.” And you explained to me
00:00:34.000 there’s no office and I was just so
00:00:36.239 confused i was like “Where does the mail
00:00:38.480 go how how do you meet with people how
00:00:40.559 you doing everything on phone and video
00:00:42.239 chat?” So So we’ve come a long way more
00:00:44.399 than 10 years now tell me you know you
00:00:46.879 have a theory that remote workplaces are
00:00:50.000 the more sustainable option absolutely i
00:00:53.120 think that being able to work remotely
00:00:55.680 means that you are not polluting that
00:00:57.680 you are uh observing more
00:01:00.160 environmentally friendly practices in
00:01:02.320 fact our own research shows that people
00:01:04.400 who work from home are a lot more likely
00:01:06.479 to be mindful about what they’re doing
00:01:09.680 in a way that impacts the planet and so
00:01:12.799 I think that there’s really no question
00:01:15.119 about what’s better for the environment
00:01:17.520 i think the thing that a lot of people
00:01:19.200 don’t really consider is oftentimes
00:01:21.759 remote work is better than an office
00:01:24.159 because you’re not being distracted by
00:01:26.479 all the in-person shenanigans of hey did
00:01:29.680 you see White Lotus or did you see what
00:01:32.079 happened in the news or let me gossip
00:01:33.439 about a co-orker who I don’t like all
00:01:35.680 those things really cut down on
00:01:37.439 productivity and when you look at
00:01:39.360 research from you know the fed for
00:01:41.360 example they find that remote work is
00:01:44.479 just as productive as you know in office
00:01:47.840 work so I don’t really see why there’s
00:01:50.560 this big question about what should we
00:01:52.399 do when we know our planet is in trouble
00:01:55.280 but I don’t think you started the
00:01:56.799 company to be remote work because you
00:01:59.119 were trying to save the planet and be
00:02:00.640 sustainable i assume this was more
00:02:02.640 because you think that was better for
00:02:03.759 the bottom line and coincidentally it
00:02:06.000 also happened to be better for the earth
00:02:07.200 tell me what was the thought process
00:02:08.639 guilty is charged i mean we looked at
00:02:10.959 this and we looked at what happened
00:02:13.120 during the first dot crash and that’s
00:02:16.879 where people could afford people or they
00:02:19.440 could afford their rent but they
00:02:21.200 couldn’t afford both and we thought what
00:02:23.200 if we never had to be in that cycle and
00:02:26.000 so we decided to be remote from the very
00:02:28.480 get-go and the thing is is that when we
00:02:30.959 were doing this already companies like
00:02:33.280 Zoom and others were launching
00:02:35.280 technologies that made remote work a lot
00:02:38.319 more manageable and a lot more efficient
00:02:41.680 and effective and so flash forward over
00:02:44.319 10 years from that point and remote work
00:02:46.959 is still going strong in fact each and
00:02:49.040 every year we see more and more
00:02:50.959 Americans embracing remote work
00:02:54.480 do you think it’s sustainable just
00:02:56.959 because of remote work or are there
00:02:58.400 other things that companies can do other
00:03:00.959 than just hey don’t come into an office
00:03:03.360 don’t commute and you know pollute on
00:03:05.120 the way to on on the office is it just a
00:03:07.519 remote work thing or are there other
00:03:08.879 things that companies can do separately
00:03:11.280 from what are what are things that
00:03:12.640 companies should they be doing is this
00:03:14.400 even their responsibility to try to save
00:03:16.319 the world versus deliver for
00:03:17.920 shareholders well you can’t deliver for
00:03:19.920 shareholders if you don’t have a
00:03:22.120 populace and you know just to kind of
00:03:24.480 build on that there are several things
00:03:26.239 companies could do if they actually
00:03:28.959 cannot be remote for example most
00:03:32.159 American uh HQ buildings are not
00:03:35.680 environmentally friendly at all and
00:03:37.840 those buildings would need to be
00:03:39.440 massively retrofit so that they can be
00:03:42.560 more environmentally sound and that’s
00:03:45.040 something that these companies could
00:03:46.799 take on if that’s really a priority for
00:03:48.720 them there’s also the idea of having you
00:03:52.560 know companies more dispersed through
00:03:54.760 neighborhoods so that people aren’t
00:03:56.799 going to a central HQ if being in person
00:04:00.000 is so vitally important and I think we
00:04:02.560 can understand that in a point of like a
00:04:05.680 doctor’s office there are certain things
00:04:07.280 that have to happen at a hospital or at
00:04:10.640 a facility like that but when it comes
00:04:12.799 to knowledge work I think that’s a place
00:04:15.120 where it’s so clear that knowledge
00:04:16.959 workers really can work from anywhere
00:04:18.959 and everywhere and so that’s really
00:04:20.959 where we can get our sustainable uh
00:04:23.520 chits in if you will how much you think
00:04:25.280 it’s a personality thing like I I think
00:04:27.360 about myself and and what I guess of you
00:04:30.479 is that in a lot of ways we’re
00:04:31.680 introverts like we want to work
00:04:33.040 one-on-one we want to work focused we we
00:04:35.520 don’t want to be in a crowded
00:04:37.199 environment with a 100 people around us
00:04:39.360 but there are people that are definitely
00:04:40.639 the opposite where they whereas you and
00:04:42.639 I would thrive I think working from home
00:04:44.560 and and being self-responsible to focus
00:04:48.000 i think a lot of other people they can’t
00:04:50.320 focus at home they need a crowd that’s
00:04:52.560 what gives them energy so do you think
00:04:54.080 that it’s not so much a remote work
00:04:56.080 thing that works for everybody or is it
00:04:57.680 just some personalities will thrive in
00:05:00.080 that environment well I would say it
00:05:02.080 depends on the remote work itself for
00:05:04.280 example frequently I have Zoom calls
00:05:07.039 that require me to be interacting with
00:05:08.880 several people so for an extrovert or an
00:05:12.080 introvert extrovert or an extrovert
00:05:13.440 introvert whatever you may be there is
00:05:15.759 always that kind of human interaction to
00:05:18.080 have i think what I hear from some
00:05:21.759 people is that they like the inoff uh
00:05:25.840 environment because they want people to
00:05:28.240 hang out with they want to have friends
00:05:31.120 and so frequently I find that’s
00:05:33.120 something for very junior people
00:05:36.320 starting their workplace uh career and
00:05:40.400 needing to create Insta friends so they
00:05:43.440 have hangout buddies and truly I
00:05:46.639 understand that on one point on the
00:05:48.800 other hand that’s really not something a
00:05:51.039 company needs to solve that’s something
00:05:53.120 a gym can solve or a bar or you know any
00:05:57.039 kind of outside interest other than work
00:05:59.840 and so that’s kind of my rejoinder to
00:06:02.479 the idea that hey I just want to have
00:06:04.080 buddies
00:06:05.759 so companies should be trying to save
00:06:07.440 the world but not trying to be a place
00:06:10.160 for people to find friends there’s a
00:06:12.080 difference that’s where you draw the
00:06:13.199 line i I’m happy for anyone to be
00:06:16.160 friends i just think that having a
00:06:18.400 polluting building to and then requiring
00:06:21.440 people to drive or commute to that
00:06:23.280 building just for the sake that they can
00:06:25.039 have work buddies is kind of silly what
00:06:27.039 about people
00:06:28.120 who you know they’ve got a bunch of
00:06:30.160 roommates or they’ve got a crowded
00:06:32.080 family situation or they’ve got a toxic
00:06:34.560 home situation and they need to go to an
00:06:36.720 office because that’s where it’s safer
00:06:37.919 for them to get work done and and home
00:06:40.080 maybe just doesn’t have the safety or
00:06:41.759 structure or or quietness to get work
00:06:43.919 done and I think that’s where co-working
00:06:46.720 spaces make a lot of sense because if
00:06:49.600 you have a situation where home is the
00:06:52.000 last place you can get anything done
00:06:53.919 okay fair i I just you know you can’t
00:06:56.560 talk me off that ledge i I get it but
00:06:59.520 that’s really an exception for a very
00:07:02.000 you know small amount of us as opposed
00:07:03.840 to the rule i know new mothers who also
00:07:06.960 have a lot of distractions going on
00:07:09.120 really you know relish the ability to uh
00:07:12.080 get back into the workforce and not have
00:07:14.319 to make sacrifices with their you know
00:07:17.039 new children so I think that to me is
00:07:19.280 another way in which you know working
00:07:20.720 from home makes more sense
00:07:23.199 you have a lot of clients in the
00:07:24.960 technology space obviously and a lot of
00:07:27.199 them are remote only operations do you
00:07:29.680 find that you’re asked for advice on how
00:07:33.199 do we build a culture how do we build
00:07:35.880 productivity and how do we build some
00:07:37.919 sort of unifying theme about what it
00:07:40.479 means to be at this company do do you
00:07:42.319 get questions of advice for some from
00:07:44.080 some of your clients absolutely and I
00:07:46.160 think the biggest question is how do we
00:07:47.840 create that cultural stickiness what
00:07:50.479 does it mean to be us and I think part
00:07:54.400 of that is in a company’s mission
00:07:57.280 statement which I know sounds a little
00:07:59.039 antiseptic but when we came up with
00:08:01.039 politely pushy we wanted to capture our
00:08:03.680 ethos in a way that was cute fun and
00:08:06.240 memorable and we really did that i think
00:08:09.039 other companies still have that
00:08:10.800 challenge where they’re trying to figure
00:08:12.000 out what’s them and what’s not i think
00:08:14.479 to go back though to the more kind of
00:08:16.520 sticky more soft touch sort of things i
00:08:19.599 think this is where really encouraging
00:08:21.520 people to have interest that they can
00:08:23.599 share with their colleagues in ways that
00:08:26.879 you know is outside of management’s
00:08:29.440 purview is really important so having a
00:08:31.599 book club for example is important
00:08:34.159 having different sort of social
00:08:36.320 activities and most importantly being
00:08:38.559 able to gather and just focus on each
00:08:41.760 other’s company not necessarily every
00:08:44.560 day or every week or every month but
00:08:46.560 there are times when it makes sense to
00:08:47.839 bring everyone together so everyone
00:08:49.600 could just focus on what it’s like to be
00:08:51.760 in a room personally now we’ve done this
00:08:53.440 at Bospar before and when we first did
00:08:56.160 it we thought people would really
00:08:57.920 collaborate and work together but no one
00:09:00.000 liked that in fact everyone could have
00:09:02.080 said that they couldn’t get anything
00:09:03.279 done with so- and so in the room or so
00:09:04.800 and so chewing but what people did want
00:09:07.040 to do is they did want to socialize they
00:09:09.200 did want to hang out they did want to
00:09:10.640 have that social time and unlike other
00:09:13.760 physical office interactions no one was
00:09:16.240 taking this time for granted everyone
00:09:17.920 was really invested in making the most
00:09:19.680 of it yeah think about like in New York
00:09:22.839 City no one goes to the Statue of
00:09:25.040 Liberty if you live in New York City
00:09:26.480 because it’s like “Oh it’s always there
00:09:27.680 i can go later.” But if you’re a tourist
00:09:29.360 you make a point of going it’s sort of
00:09:31.040 like this if you’re if you’re going to
00:09:32.640 be in the room together make a point of
00:09:34.160 of using the time valuably as opposed to
00:09:36.399 just oh we’re just sitting around here
00:09:38.240 wasting the time because I’m just going
00:09:39.600 to see you tomorrow and continue to
00:09:41.279 waste that time i definitely think that
00:09:44.000 working from home makes a lot of things
00:09:46.080 more intentional than ever before and as
00:09:49.200 someone who does not live in New York I
00:09:51.040 confess I’ve yet to visit the Statue of
00:09:53.360 Liberty sometime sometime I will but I
00:09:56.160 just it hasn’t happened yet but it’s
00:09:57.680 probably the San Francisco equivalent
00:09:59.040 there’s probably a lot of tourist things
00:10:00.240 that people will come and do that you’ve
00:10:02.000 been there for a long time that you’ve
00:10:03.200 still never done because you can always
00:10:04.640 do it tomorrow in which case then you
00:10:05.920 never do it absolutely and like the sea
00:10:08.959 lions for example they’re there going
00:10:12.240 but I don’t want to go and see them
00:10:16.160 outside of remote work what are some
00:10:18.000 other sustainability practices that that
00:10:20.880 companies could try to do in different
00:10:23.519 dimensions are there other things that
00:10:25.200 you think about or that you talk to
00:10:26.560 clients about i think that one of the
00:10:29.839 things that people are looking about is
00:10:31.839 their energy spend and what that’s like
00:10:35.279 and how they could be being more
00:10:37.519 thoughtful of their energy spend and uh
00:10:40.720 their resources that way i think when it
00:10:42.800 comes to data and data use that’s going
00:10:45.600 to be a more and more important
00:10:48.000 dimension to people’s thinking and I
00:10:50.959 think that
00:10:52.519 ultimately uh companies that create data
00:10:56.800 architecture or data use that is you
00:10:59.200 know responsible or less energy
00:11:01.519 impactful I think is going to be more
00:11:03.519 and more important as the years go on
00:11:06.160 especially with everything we’ve seen
00:11:07.839 with crypto AI data centers the energy
00:11:10.320 spends just going up and up and up i
00:11:12.079 don’t see a situation where AI where
00:11:15.120 energy spend is going to go down i mean
00:11:16.640 do you no not at all i think that we are
00:11:19.839 looking at ways in which we could be
00:11:21.680 smarter about how we are uh getting that
00:11:25.040 data and we’re looking for efficiencies
00:11:27.600 that might require some super
00:11:29.600 imaginative ideas to make uh those
00:11:32.480 energy centers even more impactful and
00:11:34.880 efficient but I cannot imagine us uh
00:11:38.320 going down now that we are hooked on AI
00:11:41.680 yeah definitely hooked on AI i’m sure
00:11:42.959 there’ll be some AI involved in the
00:11:44.560 making of this podcast somewhere whether
00:11:46.399 it’s an whether it’s an edit or some
00:11:48.480 sort of upload or something like that
00:11:50.000 there’s AI without us even realizing it
00:11:52.720 what do you what did you learn from
00:11:55.040 because I know you did the big Earth Day
00:11:56.320 survey a year ago so you’ve had a year
00:11:58.079 to sort of implement things that you
00:11:59.600 learned or talk about that what were
00:12:00.800 some of the big findings that you found
00:12:02.399 now looking back exactly 12 months i
00:12:04.880 think the biggest finding was one that
00:12:06.480 we didn’t find which was that when you
00:12:09.360 work from home five days a week you cut
00:12:12.480 your carbon footprint by more than half
00:12:15.440 and that was a finding that actually
00:12:17.360 came out a little bit after the pandemic
00:12:20.079 started and that was I think a huge
00:12:25.200 moment for me in terms of quantifying
00:12:28.639 how important working from home is
00:12:31.200 because I think we just had a vague
00:12:33.200 sense that it was better because we
00:12:34.720 didn’t have a commute we just didn’t
00:12:36.240 know how uh important this sort of uh
00:12:40.000 carbon reduction was and the thing that
00:12:42.720 I learned is most people did not know
00:12:44.639 about it most people had this sense of
00:12:47.360 oh yeah it’s you know better but I don’t
00:12:50.000 know how and then when you told them how
00:12:52.800 more how much more environmentally
00:12:55.920 responsible they were by doing this
00:12:57.600 there was a bit of shock really and then
00:13:00.160 there was kind of some hedging like but
00:13:02.000 what if I did it for four days or what
00:13:03.600 if I did it for three and we found out
00:13:05.920 that the uh diminishment of returns when
00:13:09.360 you just did a hybrid model was actually
00:13:11.440 very substantial and partly it was
00:13:13.839 because that this was not a pattern that
00:13:16.399 you had muscle memory for this was
00:13:18.639 something that was new for you and so
00:13:21.279 really five days a week is significant
00:13:23.760 and I think that more and more companies
00:13:26.160 are going to be held to that standard as
00:13:28.480 we have more and more problems with
00:13:29.839 climate change
00:13:32.079 what do you look forward to in the next
00:13:33.360 year as we look where are we going to be
00:13:35.680 Earth Day 2026 what do you hope could
00:13:38.480 have happened or at least internally at
00:13:39.920 Bospar
00:13:41.920 i think that each year we have Earth Day
00:13:44.560 we’re going to have more and more people
00:13:45.839 looking at dramatic ways to improve the
00:13:48.399 environment because I think we’re going
00:13:50.720 to see more fires more freak weather
00:13:54.079 more crop damage and I think those are
00:13:56.639 going to be the serious reminders that
00:13:58.959 this is not an a feel-good exercise this
00:14:02.079 is the survival of our species at stake
00:14:05.040 and the more times we see that the more
00:14:06.880 times people are going to reconsider how
00:14:10.000 they’re investing in uh climate friendly
00:14:13.000 technology and I’m hopeful that that’s
00:14:15.760 going to be the thing that saves their
00:14:17.959 species i hope we can be saved curtis
00:14:20.639 you’re leading the charge thank you so
00:14:22.160 much and we’ll talk to you soon thanks
00:14:24.240 Eric
00:14:25.490 [Music]
00:14:30.639 thank you to my guest and thanks for
00:14:32.240 listening subscribe to get the latest
00:14:34.000 episodes each week and we’ll see you
00:14:35.760 next time
00:14:37.010 [Applause]
00:14:37.990 [Music]